Daily Kitten Chat Forum » General Chat

1. 

   Here is what the HR Rep emailed me at 9:30pm on 7/23 the day this all happened. The remarks were made at 11:30am and she doesn't phone me to talk about it but instead sends an email. This basically says to me, you were wrong and that it is nothing and just deal with it. I removed the names to protect all involved. I am very disappointed with her response and really feel let down here. She doesn't see the comments as bad apparently but as expressing opinions and doesn't see that they were in fact very hostile comments.

   I feel very demotivated to work at this company with this kind of lack of support from HR but will continue to work as well as possible while looking for another job. It is going to be hard having to hear this guy's voice without feeling upset. Obviously they do not value their employees or at least they don't value me.

   "Hello-

   Thank you for the email and for expressing your concerns.

   In reading your recap below, it is important to remember that everyone has a right to opinions whether it's on animals politics, etc. It is apparent from below that you and Tracy have a difference in opinion on cats and he was then making comments on tax deductions to further his point. You clearly needed to walk away which you did, but then returned and by calling "Employee" a name ( per below ). No good comes from personal attacks because then they continue to serve back and forth, which you both par-took in, again per below.

   My recommended next steps should be if your comfortable (once this has had some time) is to set a few minutes with Tracy and just express that you both have differences in opinion on the cat matter ( which you take to heart ) and it's okay to "agree to disagree" and form a truce. If you are not comfortable with this you can choose not to engage with him at all or I can facilitate the meeting with both of you and your managers.

   If there are other comments that said Employee has made that you would like to discuss that have made you uncomfortable, I am happy to do so with you and Manager."

   Posted 2 years ago by SylMiaFelixMomma #

2. 

   Sorry you didn't get support from HR. At least you know which co-workers are not worth speaking to.

   Posted 2 years ago by 2bpurring #

3. 

   SMM...if this inconsiderate bafoon continues ro make comments like he did before,within earshot, I would definately request a meeting between you,him,HR & managers. In my eyes,that is a form of instigation & harassment,& makes it hard for a person to concentrate on doing the best job they can do. Such immaturity on his part saying things he knows will hurt someones feelings. If he's busy making comments like that.he isn't doing the job he's being paid to do.
   {{{HUGS}}}

   Posted 2 years ago by feral #

4. 

   I am sorry SMM I had hoped that HR would see that the comments created a hostile work environment. I do hope that you do not have to have any contact with him. He certainly isn't anyone that I would respect his views on. He insults both precious cats and humans alike.

   Posted 2 years ago by SoxsMom #

5. 

   I don't think she was just saying that you were wrong, but that you and this person engaged in what we call a tit-for-tat. She thinks that you should have walked away and left it alone. I realize that is not always easy to do (probably more than most people, because my ears are sharp, my 'vibes' never lead me wrong and I have a short fuse), but maybe you could work on it.

   I know it's easier said than done, but a lot of times walking away really gets another person's goat because that's not what they want you to do. When you walk away you 'get the last word' so to speak. Burns people up. Try it and see, sweetie.

   I'm sorry you don't think HR backed you up, but I think they were as fair as they could be in the situation.

   ((Hugs))

   Posted 2 years ago by HuddysMama #

6. 

   HM, I am already aware of that I should have walked away and left it alone. This wasn't just an expressing of opinions but a very hostile comment. I know from now on to walk away and notify HR. To me this constitutes harassment if he continues this type of behavior. See below as to what I mean...

   I wrote this note back to the HR rep and cc'd my manager:

   "Please be aware this wasn't just expressing difference of opinions. Telling someone who loves their cats like they are her human children that he would put her cat on a stick and serve it is a very sick and hostile comment in my book. He was basicallly saying to me, I would kill your cat, barbque it on a stick and serve it to be eaten. This comment to me is like if someone had said I am going to torture and kill your human baby. Imagine the horror and how upset you would feel if someone said this to you. Some would say it isn't the same as animals cannot be compared to humans but to a cat lover, it is the same. We put the same value in our animals as you would in your human child. So this is a serious commment and not an difference of opinions as was pointed out below.

   I feel that someone needs to explain the importance to Tracy of honoring a request when someone says, please do not use that phrase around me. He needs to understand and respect that if someone feels uncomfortable when he says a certain phrase or comment, that he refrain from using it. It is just as if someone said a rude joke in the office, and someone asks them to not say these kind of jokes in the office place. It is a form of harassment and said employee needs to be aware of this. It would be appreciated if you would meet with employee to inform them of this and notify me once they have been spoken to. I will avoid them from now on."

   Posted 2 years ago by SylMiaFelixMomma #

7. 

   Excellent response to HR, SMM. Well expressed. The point isn't so much that he said it initially it is that he persisted when you asked him from refraining. To me his attitude is right up there with someone who is asked to not make racial, religious, gender remarks but who continues. Let us know if HR responds.

   Posted 2 years ago by KYKAT 12 23 #

8. 

   Ages ago, I was sitting in the parents' observation room at the Tae Kwon Do studio where my boss's son was taking a lesson. The father of one of the other students was having a conversation with another parent about the cruel things he used to do to cats when he was a child. I turned around and gave him the coldest, most disgusted glare that I could manage. The conversation stopped immediately, and from that time on, that father went out of his way to give me a smile or nod when we met at the studio.

   "Tracy" wasn't worth the effort you put into cursing him out, although I understand why you did it.

   Posted 2 years ago by Leeny #

9. 

   {{Hugs}} I hope this all works out for you, SMM. And, I think you did a great job with your answer to the HR rep.

   Posted 2 years ago by corzak #

10. 

    Oh, and {{{SMM}}} and {{{her kitties}}}

    Posted 2 years ago by Leeny #

11. 

    Thank you. I just spoke with my manager and she doesn't want to get involved and I said it was between HR, the other employee and myself. I was just informing her as to why I left in tears on Thursday. She had no empathy for me but instead said that the said employee was always pleasant and it was strange for this to happen. I said in response that I didn't even provoke said employee and didn't know why they acted so harshly. My manager said it was between us and HR as that they weren't there when it happened. I find this odd for my manager to say this because a proper manager would get involved. I know that if were two other employees in my group who the manager treats like they are their son, they would get involved. Just another affirmation that I am not a valued employee. Great. Thanks for nothing.

    So work hard, keep performance up and keep nose down to the grind stone and if and when the economy gets better, find another employer who takes care of their employees like Amgen or Google or other companies do.

    Posted 2 years ago by SylMiaFelixMomma #

12. 

    Quick check in and saw this... excellent response SMM... I might also suggest, that you go through the chain of command if an incident happens again. Start with your supervisor and document, document, document. Also, remember this, it's easier to find a job when you have one! So start looking!

    Posted 2 years ago by Jetta and Boo Boo's Mom #

13. 

    ((((((SMM)))))))) I know just how you feel. Different reasons but certainly don't feel valued. In my case I am only a couple of years until retirement so I'm hanging in there.

    Posted 2 years ago by Cat talk rules #

14. 

    She can't say anything because she wasn't there. She doesn't know what happened, all she has is what you said and what he said - if he said anything at all. You guys may just have a personality conflict. It happens. You aren't going to like everybody and everybody isn't going to like you. Just avoid this person as much as you can and concentrate on making YOUR days the best they can be. ((hugs))

    Posted 2 years ago by HuddysMama #

15. 

    Ugh. I'm just now catching up on all this, and what an awful thing for you to have to go through, SMM. It sounds like HR is thoroughly adhered to the fence (I was going to say something else about HR, but decided I better not so that my post wouldn't get deleted).

    "Hostile work environment," "terroristic threat" and "lawsuit" would be suitable words to include in a future letter to HR if you receive no help. That should get them to pay attention.

    {{{{big hugs}}}} for you, SMM, and for those of you who've dealt with similar insensitive people. I've been lucky in that the place where I currently work (and will soon leave) understands that pets are as much a part of the family as children.

    Posted 2 years ago by Cats4Cats #

16. 

    I want to add that I feel respected and valued by my peers and immediate supervisors but the actions of upper management leave much to be desired. Unfortunately they know nothing about the real work that keeps the place going. I just wanted to say that because it would be unfair to many people I work with to leave my comment like I did.

    Posted 2 years ago by Cat talk rules #

17. 

    I have noticed that if you say you have cats, there's always one person who has to go into detail of how they hate cats and when they were younger they did this that and the other thing. I just tune them out - they just aren't worth whatever little gem I could put them down with.

    Posted 2 years ago by HuddysMama #

18. 

    My parents were of the opinion that people who did not care for cats or dogs were untrustworthy. Anybody tells me they don't like cats I'm leery of them

    Posted 2 years ago by Cat talk rules #

19. 

    I've always considered it an honor to be loved by cats and children. Both are perceptive and straightforward about their feelings.

    Posted 2 years ago by Leeny #

20. 

    Hugs coming your way across the miles.

    Posted 2 years ago by Tigerlilly #

21. 

    Thank you to those who provide words of support for me. HM, no need to explain things for the other side as I already understand.

    A good manager who cares about their employees asks what is wrong and offers support. A manager who says they do not want to get involved proves they do not support the employee (me). I have had good and bad managers and know the difference.

    Hope everyone else's day goes well. I appreciate those who have shown their support for me.

    Posted 2 years ago by SylMiaFelixMomma #

22. 

    Oh, dear - I'm just finding this. Many hugs, SMM!

    Posted 2 years ago by WillowandWindismom #

23. 

    It's a good thing I wasn't within earshot of that sadistic and unprofessional verbal assault at your office SMM. Your co-worker knew exactly what he was doing to you, after you professionally requested that he stop. I have "butted in" on verbal attacks on co-workers several times in my working life. I never bothered to confront these people directly, they are the type who just laugh at other people's discomfort. They actually enjoy it. I always complained straight at the top. Of course HR and management would often try to just blow it off with reassurances like "they are just kidding". I would politely remind them that sick and twisted "kidding" should be done on "their own time" and not in the workplace where everyone is forced to listen. We can't always just clock out because we are sickened by another co-workers totally innappropriate workplace "kidding" or verbally offensive conversation that is within earshot. They owe to it all employees to be free from verbal harrasement and it goes beyond racial or gender. Joking about killing *anyone* is never appropriate and HR can at least send an office memo reminding the sick person of company policy if there is one. If there isn't a policy about death and torture jokes they need to make one. It's so hard SMM when someone has succeeded at pushing you to tears and that is what this sadist has done. Unfortunately with management you must be businesslike about reporting these sick co-workers. If you ever hear such things going on again, document time, place etc. and quietly send an e-mail, letter or whatever you think is best. Don't engage these torturers in conversation, they love to "poke a stick in your cage" so to speak and then feel giddy with joy about it. It took me years to understand the difference between people who have a conscience and people who don't. I pray your company gets it's professional act together. {{{{{SMM}}}}}

    Posted 2 years ago by krazikat #

24. 

    SMM all I can offer you is the gentlest of hugs {{{SMM}}} because otherwise I would say really unfluffy things about the person in your department, your HR department and your very own Manager.

    Posted 2 years ago by AZDEBRA 5/27 & crew #

25. 

    Good response SMM! I hope you don't have to work too closely with this bozo...he's a thoughtless jerk! Unfortunately there are people like him in most workplaces. =( ((((SMM))))

    Posted 2 years ago by Karenopa #

26. 

    It is almost time to go home and no response from HR to my last email. It is possible that either they are out of the office or just too busy to deal with it at this time.

    Thank you again for all your support. I truly appreciate it. If I go to my parents about this I will not receive any empathy like I have felt here as they don't want to hear about these kind of things.

    Posted 2 years ago by SylMiaFelixMomma #

27. 

    More {{{HUGS}}}, SMM. There are a lot of jerks in the world!

    Posted 2 years ago by jcat #

28. 

    Just read this thread and I must say I find the behaviour of that idiot you work with shocking. And your management clearly is not competent. When miso was being tested for what turned out to be asthma, and we didn't know whether it was something more serious, I was very upset in work, and my boss, a very busy lady, came to see me and put her arms around me (she is owned by 2 cats too). Reading this thread I realise how lucky I am. SMM, maybe Lainey is right and you should start to look around for another position now.

    Posted 2 years ago by eleniki #

29. 

    (((Karin)))

    Posted 2 years ago by GreatDane #

30. 

    Still going around in circles. This HR rep loves to make it sound like I am asking for something that I didn't ask for so below that is my response.

    Eleniki, believe me I have started looking for another job but in this horrible economy, it is going to be hard to land a new one what with competition being fierce. Even the temp jobs are offering rates of $10/hr less than what they were just last year and one cannot afford to live on that much of a reduction in pay.

    Anyways here is the HR reps response that came at 5:40 pm last night.

    Hello-

    I am happy to sit down with your manager, yourself, said employee and employee's boss to discuss this. I can facilitate the meeting, but I am not comfortable conveying your feelings/opinions on your behalf, for that would not be productive for either party. We are all professionals and we should talk to one another and give said employee the opportunity to explain, apologize, or at least make it clear to them how they made you feel and set boundaries with one another with HR (me) present. If this then continues, we will have it recorded that said employee has been spoken to by HR and yourself. Please let me know if you would like to move forward with this plan.

    (HR Rep)

    I responded back to HR with this:

    Hello (HR Rep),

    I spoke with my manager about this all yesterday morning and was informed that the manager doesn't feel they need to be involved because they didn't witness any of this and feel that it is between said employee, myself and HR (you).

    As to conveying my feelings on my behalf, that wasn't what I was asking for nor would I ever ask that of HR. What this is about is how to conduct oneself in a professional manner in an office. As in any office environment, when someone makes an inappropriate comment, is asked to stop and they keep using the comment, it is construed as a sort of harassment. In light of that it is usually recommended that they be re-educated about the company harassment policy. What I am asking for is for HR to re-educate said employee on the company harassment policy. That would be the professional way to handle this issue. As for boundaries with said employee, we are to refrain from any contact from one another from now. Our jobs do not require us to interact with one another so I see that as quite doable.

    If you feel our managers need to be involved in a face to face meeting with said employee, myself and yourself, then let me know."

    I feel as though the HR Rep is making it to be more than they need to make it. I have a feeling the HR Rep is trying to wear me down and get me to just say let it all go. I will not let it go. Said employee needs to learn it isn't appropriate to continue a comment when another asks them to stop.

    Posted 2 years ago by SylMiaFelixMomma #

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