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I need some advice about banks

(35 posts)
  • Started 2 weeks ago by owlwatcher_974
  • Latest reply from Buttercup
  1. This is kind of long so please bear with me.

    Over the last few months, the bank I have had a checking account with for over 10 years has been taking money out of my account. I realize my records are not always perfect so when I would check out my account online and the banks records would show that I had $5, $10, or even $15 dollars less than I thought I had, I figured maybe I had made a mistake and forgotten to write something down.

    Two months ago, I deposited two checks from customers. Later I noticed that they had subtracted $75 from my account. When I contacted them by phone, I found out that it was something to do with one of the checks. I didn't find out until two weeks later that they had lost the check. They claimed it was never in the envelope. They granted me a temporary credit of $75 until their investigation was over. I never added that $75 to the balance in my books - nor did I use the money - because I was fairly certain that it would be removed in a couple of weeks anyway.

    When the investigation was finished, I received a letter saying that because I had never provided them with the items they requested (??? they never requested anything from me) that they were unable to complete the investigation, and the $75 dollar credit would be removed from my account. Two days later I noticed that $75 was gone from my account and the balance they showed now matched what I had in my book. I was a little concerned that there was nothing to indicate that money had been taken out - no explanation of any debit to my account or anything, but I figured it would show up in a day or to. Two days later the reversal of credit showed up on my account and another $75 dollars was removed from my account.

    I called to straighten things out, but the people I talked to said that money is never taken out of an account without a debit being shown and that I was mistaken because there was only one $75 debit to my account. They refused to listen to me, and basically said that they were right, I was wrong and that was that.

    I began to think I must have accidentally added the temporary credit somewhere down the line and decided to keep much better records. A few days later I noticed that $5 dollars was missing without any record of money being taken out of the account. Then the day before yesterday $20 disappeared and the balance they had listed from two days before was changed. But not having done a printout of the previous balances, I had no proof. The problem was that the missing $20 came right before my dmv renewal and a payment to one of my credit cards got to the bank. Now thanks to the bank ripping me off and the two overdraft fees, I am $100 in the hole. I only make $200 a month and my next grant check won't get her until next month so I am screwed.

    I did a search on ripoffreport.com, and after sifting through many, many pages of complaints against this bank, I found several complaints just like mine - money mysteriously vanishing out of accounts.

    I know I can't get my money back. I spent over two hours that day when the $20 vanished, talking on the phone to them and in person at the bank. They basically treat me like I am the one who made the mistake and am now trying to rip them off.

    My only recourse is to change banks. The only other banks close enough for me to consider are Bank of America and Washington Mutual. I want to know if any of you have done business with either of these two banks and can give me any kind of recommendation on them. I don't want to get away from the bank I have now just to find I have jumped out of the fire and onto the surface of the sun.

    Posted 2 weeks ago by owlwatcher_974 #

  2. OhmiGod, OW, if I were them, I would be jumping all over this because it seems to me that someone on their staff might be taking money, I can't think of any other reason why this would happen. Have you brought the website to their attention?

    There is only one bank in the UK, NZ or France that I have ever been happy with and that is our local little TSB bank. I hope someone can help you with both your problems -- the missing money and a good bank. {{{OW}}}

    Posted 2 weeks ago by jcat #

  3. You need to get with your customer to make sure the check has or has not cleared their bank, and if it has, ask them for a copy of the check, front and back, so you can take it to your bank - don't talk to a teller - ask for the head teller or someone over them. It is a hassle, but you will need to do this in person, to get the best service. It might be a good idea to close out that bank account and start a new one, because obviously someone who shouldn't has accessed your account. Do not be embarrassed to cause a scene, and do not take their word that nothing can be done, especially if you have proof that the check cleared your customers bank. If the check did not clear your customers bank, they should put a stop payment on it, and then reissue you a new check that you can then deposit into your account. Unless the check was stolen by a employee of the bank and you can prove that, you will probably be stuck with the overdraft charges, but it won't hurt you to ask your bank if something can be done, since you have been a customer in good standing with them, and if it was stolen by an employee, the police need to be notified so you have a report and maybe charges could be filed against whoever needs to be charged. Believe me, there are records that can be made available to you, copies of your statement going back for however long you might need, get them from your bank and question everything from now on. Good luck with this.

    Posted 2 weeks ago by KarenCentennial #

  4. Nobody outside the bank has accessed my account. This is being done within the bank as no debits are ever shown and I am not the only one this is happening to. The missing check has never been cashed so it is basically lost for good.

    I am getting ready to close this account and go to another bank to get away from these thieves.

    Posted 2 weeks ago by owlwatcher_974 #

  5. OW, I see what Karen is saying. If they 'lost' your cheque (either by someone within the bank stealing it or they just lost it), then either it will have been cashed, and the money taken out of your customer's account (stolen) or it will not have been taken out of their account (lost) and the customer can put a stop on that particular cheque and pay you again, as no money will have been taken from their account.

    Your bank may have no records but they cannot stop your customer's bank from having records, showing whether the cheque was cashed (stolen) or never cashed (in which case your customer hasn't paid you).

    The only problem would be if your customer's bank WAS your bank, in which case they need to get onto it as someone is taking them for a ride. But, even so, either the money WAS taken out of your customer's account or it wasn't. You need to check with your customer.

    One thing that worked for me when I was dealing with an overseas bank that insisted it had transferred a client's payment to me from France and I hadn't got it, was I got my bank (the TSB) to write their bank an official letter stating categorically that no money had been received into my account. The French bank took notice of that like they'd never taken notice of anything else (they had told my French client I was trying it on) and finally found the payment (they'd sent it to Australia -- no comment). Banks listen to other banks. Your bank couldn't ignore a letter from another bank stating the cheque had been cashed.

    You should be able to request copies of previous (written) statements (not printouts). They may make you pay for them but they must have them. If money is going missing regularly without being shown as debited, it must show somewhere in the running totals from statement to statement (I would have thought).

    Posted 2 weeks ago by jcat #

  6. Sorry, double post, senior moment!

    Posted 2 weeks ago by jcat #

  7. customer's bank has no record of the check either. it just disappeared.

    Posted 2 weeks ago by owlwatcher_974 #

  8. OW, how is that possible? Are you sure your customer wrote it? American cheques have numbers on them, right? So either the cheque with that number on it has been cashed, and it will show up on the statement, or it hasn't, and you need to ask your customer to stop it and pay you again.

    It's no skin off your customer's nose to pay you again because if it's truly disappeared, you haven't been paid by them yet, no money's come out of their account.

    Posted 2 weeks ago by jcat #

  9. OW, was this BOA?

    Posted 2 weeks ago by lisaeylau #

  10. Banks make most of their money with the overdraft fees that they charge, and they just love to pay a check that is off by just a few pennies - I made an error on a van loan payment back in May - I mis-wrote the check for under the correct amount by .08 and I was charged a $15.00 late fee - I went to the credit union that I pay the loan payment to and complained because their teller didn't catch the error and I was there in person to make the payment. They canceled the late charge and agreed that it was their error - all I had to do was make the .08 payment. Keep your receipts when you make a deposit and always check your statements. I do online banking just because Richard wasn't always letting me know when he used the business card, and I got angry with him and the bank and laid down the law to him - it is hard to blame the bank when it was obviously a communication problem on his part. The overdraft charges are outrageous now and if I wasn't able to access our info online, I would have ulcers again!

    Posted 2 weeks ago by KarenCentennial #

  11. I'm with Jcat...you should ask your customer to put a stop payment on the original check & have a new one written.
    I hate to ask...is the customer who wrote the check to you trustworthy? I ask because the check doesn't show up in his/her account either.

    Posted 2 weeks ago by feral #

  12. okay - so if the customer said that the check has not cleared their bank, they definitely need to get a stop payment immediately - this check can be changed in the amount and then cashed very easily for more money than they actually wrote it for, and they would be out the funds as well as you. If they are good customers, they should have no problem with re-issuing you a new check and then you would only be out the bank charges - much better than being out of all the money, at least.

    Posted 2 weeks ago by KarenCentennial #

  13. Feral, that's what I don't get. There should be at least half a paper trail...

    Posted 2 weeks ago by jcat #

  14. I think what OW meant when she said that the customers bank had no record of the check is just that - the customer has a check register that they keep their balance and all that - we know about all this - but the check never cleared customers bank - so it is considered lost until it is cashed and then if it is cashed by someone other than OW it is considered stolen. Again - your customer needs to get a stop payment to protect their account in the event this check is "found" and cashed by someone else.

    Posted 2 weeks ago by KarenCentennial #

  15. Contact your state's attorney general. Also, try to find how to report this to federal bank examiners.

    Posted 2 weeks ago by Marnet #

  16. Lisa, it couldn't have been BOA she was considering changing over to them.

    OW, pls do have the customer stop payment on the check, whether its lost or not it hasn't paid the monies to you, and they can re-issue another check to you. My bank (which I have had since 1992) lately has been having issues also with their own tellers taking money out of my account and handing it (literally) to another bank patron with almost the same name (she had no id, forgot her address, and needed a money order....what the heck her name was almost the same as mine) and it was only about $700. Good luck.

    Posted 2 weeks ago by AZDEBRA 5/27 & crew #

  17. The customer is fully aware of the situation and she is the one who decided that she did not want to spend the money to put a stop payment on the check. She has already written me another check, so that is not an issue.

    The thing I am having problems with is the money disappearing out of my account with no records of any money being taken out. From what I have read on ripoffreport.com, I am not the only person this has happened to, and none of those people were able to get their money back either. The only thing I can do is to change banks and get away from Wells Fargo as quick as I can. That's why I was wanting to know about those other two banks because I want to get as much information as I can before I choose a bank.

    Posted 2 weeks ago by owlwatcher_974 #

  18. Just wanted to let you know I went thru this with BOA, so don't go there. They have terrible problems with their online processing group, which is outsourced.

    Posted 2 weeks ago by lisaeylau #

  19. Well, WaMu is now taken over by Chase Bank. We have been customers of Wash. Mutual for over 20 years with no problem. Now that Chase has it, it's a mess. My Visa has always been paid on time and always more than the minimum amount. Yet when Chase took over they raised my rate from 18% to 29% !! And when we deposit a check, we are not allowed to take cash out until the next day, which is a pain for us since Victor and I are homebound and it is really hard for us to get to the bank twice in one week. If you want to change, find a credit union. They are much friendlier and easier to deal with. We moved out account to one and have been very happy.

    Posted 2 weeks ago by rainingwolf 6/15 #

  20. PS-and when I rolled over my Visa to the credit union, my rate went DOWN to 12% !

    Posted 2 weeks ago by rainingwolf 6/15 #

  21. I agree with Rainingwolf, go to a credit union. I would and am still considering it, its just such a pain to change everything over from my current account.

    Posted 2 weeks ago by AZDEBRA 5/27 & crew #

  22. I agree with RW...ever since Chase took over...everyone I know that banks w/them is in really bad shape. Stay away from Chase. They'll sc**w you in every way possible.

    Posted 2 weeks ago by feral #

  23. I vote for a credit union as well. Since they are 'owned' by the members (everyone who belongs to it) they aren't trying to make big bucks for their executives and their stockholders.

    Posted 2 weeks ago by CheetahBoysmommy #

  24. Thank you all for the advice. We have Arrowhead Credit Union here, and while their locations aren't as convenient as the banks, it looks like the perfect choice. They only have 2 complaints on ripoffreport.com, while the banks I have checked out all have over 1500 complaints.

    Now I just have to wait for the checks I just deposited to clear before I can apply for a checking account at Arrowhead.

    Posted 2 weeks ago by owlwatcher_974 #

  25. I hate banks---go to a credit union. I would report them to your state banking commission. They are required to show you where your money went---they have records going back so don't let them bully you. Make as much noise as possible if they won't help you-they don't want other customers to hear how they ripped you off!

    Posted 2 weeks ago by Sheba's Mom in Phx, AZ #

  26. You might want to file a complaint with your state's Attorney General. They are the top guns and have the authority to pursue an investigation of the bank. Definitely order your last several months of statements so you can pinpoint where there are discrepancies. Also once you have the statements as proof and have closed the account and have your money safely at the credit union, write a letter to the editor of the newspaper and call your local television stations and raise holy heck with them.

    Posted 2 weeks ago by KYKAT 12 23 #

  27. i love my credit union. i've been with them for 26 years. there are very nice and they also have a web site where i can do just about anything there...

    Posted 2 weeks ago by Cheri 12/22 #

  28. Thank you all for your advice. I am going to apply for a checking account at Arrowhead credit union as soon as the checks I deposited are cleared and I can get my money out to start another account.

    After all the fees and the money disappearing out of my account, I am out $125. I am not going to try to file any complaints, as I simply have no proof. I have the notebook that I use to keep track of my balance and I have the last couple of deposit slips with the check images on them. But I don't have the running total from the bank, and October's statement is not available yet. However, there is a $20 discrepancy on the September statement and I can see where they deliberately stop listing the running balance a few transactions before the $20 disappears and later on another $10 disappears.

    Yes I could go and fight, but I doubt I would have any better luck that the others who have tried to fight this same problem. The bank is always right, there is something we are not seeing, or whatever reason they can think of to keep from crediting the account and returning the money that has disappeared. I think I will just get out of there as fast as I can before they can steal any more of my money.

    Posted 2 weeks ago by owlwatcher_974 #

  29. That is exactly what the thief is banking on--that you will not make waves and they can continue to rob people. It is your choice, but with you limited funds you live on you deserve all your money. Living on $200 a month is very little and $125 lost is over half your monthly income. I understand not wanting to go to the trouble--but you were robbed just the same as if some thug walked up to you on the street with a gun and demanded your money.

    Posted 2 weeks ago by SoxsMom #

  30. OW, I know it's a pain to fight but I think this is outrageous. People need to know about this. When the October statement comes out, I would simply photocopy the statements, highlight with a highlighter pen the places where discrepancies occur, and send with a short covering letter -- eg I believe money has been disappearing from my account. The bank refuses to investigate, please see attached statements with discrepancies highlighted -- to the Attorney General's office, with a copy to your local newspaper and TV news station. That wouldn't be too much trouble, would it? It's stealing, that's all it is!

    Discrepancies on the statement ($20!) and stopping showing the running total SPEAK FOR THEMSELVES! You don't need any further proof for investigation to be warranted!

    Posted 2 weeks ago by jcat #


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